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Sunday, September 12, 2010

Lord Stern reminds us climate change IS happening because of man made pollution



Despite what climate deniers Whaleoil, Cactus Kate, Kiwiblogh, No Minister, Not PC (and to a much lesser degree of influence, the fundy MacDr) have to say, it was nice to see Lord Stern reminding us that climate change is happening and that it is happening because of man made pollution...

What bothers him most is the way deniers seize on "oscillations" or fluctuations in temperature and try to argue there is no trend. "If you've got an undergraduate student, trying to estimate the growth of the economy by joining a line between the peak of the last boom to the bottom of the last recession and think they are estimating the growth rate you would throw them out of class."

The same poor logic is used by deniers who try to argue temperature stopped rising 10 years ago - completely false when you look at the trend, ask about the overall average and apply knowledge about why decadal oscillations occur.

"Ordinary sensible people looking at evidence will know that you have to take an average over time and if you do that you see every decade over the last five to six decades has been hotter than the previous ones."


...if I had a dollar for every anonotroll clown who posts here their cut and paste argument claiming these ridiculous points, I'd have enough to bail out South Canterbury Finance on my own. It was good to see Lord Stern attack the mainstream media who have allowed climate deniers like Whaleoil, Cactus Kate, Kiwiblogh, No Minister, Not PC (and to a much lesser degree of influence, the fundy MacDr) to hijack the debate with their climate denial bullshit...

A large measure of why the story isn't properly told he puts down to a failure of media and journalism. Yes, says Stern, the onslaught against the story is strong and organised, but it's irrational, unscientific and badly based. It says because you can't identify relationships with certainty, the best assumption is they don't exist. "That's a schoolboy error."

Stern says the media fails to look at the wider context - something that should have happened regarding the hacked "Climategate" emails from the University of East Anglia. "What journalists should have asked is that if everything that the university had done was obliterated, what difference would it make? The answer to that question would be hardly any difference at all."

Similarly, the IPCC paper incorrectly predicting Himalayan glaciers retreating should be seen in a wider view: "This idea that if you find a few papers that are wrong among a few thousand papers you've somehow undermined all the evidence is so intellectually dishonest, it's very important to expose that intellectual dishonesty for what it is."


...and that really is the point, the mainstream media in this country have allowed Whaleoil (who posts sleazy, wrongful edits of Jim Anderton), Cactus Kate (mouthpiece of ACT and apologist for Rodney's bullying), Kiwiblogh (mouthpiece for National on-line), No Minister (right wing hate speech site), Not PC (delusional Nanny State site) and to a much lesser degree of influence, the fundy Christian God complex of MacDr to inject their climate denial to pollute the debate and shut down political action against climate change.

When future generations are looking for someone to blame over the inaction, they must condemn the mainstream media for allowing themselves to be so influenced by these fringe climate deniers.

6 Comments:

At 12/9/10 8:07 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"When future generations are looking for someone to blame over the inaction, they must condemn the mainstream media for allowing themselves to be so influenced by these fringe climate deniers."

Oh you mean allowing people to hear both sides of the debate?

Damn free speech, should be banned if some people don't get their way.

 
At 12/9/10 8:41 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Still promoting your green religion I see bomber.

 
At 12/9/10 8:56 pm, Blogger Bomber said...

Oh you mean allowing people to hear both sides of the debate?

Damn free speech, should be banned if some people don't get their way.

No I'm taking about not allowing creationists over take the debate at an evolution debate.

Still promoting your green religion I see bomber.
Still posting anonymously I see, hope you got to see Q+A this morning with Lord Stern.

 
At 13/9/10 2:23 am, Blogger Wayne said...

I was fortunate enough to be able to listen to Lord Stern on Friday night at Auckland uni.

He gave an excellent lecture, and his points are made in a measured tone, backed with the full force of evidence and incontestable logic. The guy is very impressive.

I especially appreciated his point on equity. The developing world has every right to want to improve the living standards of its people, and if the West wants the developing world to cooperate, there is a moral obligation to provide resources and money to help them to do this. Especially in light of the fact that the developed world have produced most the emissions to date.

In his speech, Lord Stern praised China highly for doing its part and also for its considerable investment in green technology. Lord Stern encourages all to get into the 'green race.'

Western countries are mostly behind the eight ball on this, especially the US - because of the lack of political will.

This political will of course derives from what is or what is not politically expedient. In the West, manipulation of public opinion by a mischievous few could well be decisive in preventing Western nations from taking necessary action.

Perhaps a case for authoritarian rule by a meritocratic elite (note all of China's top leaders are trained professional engineers)?

If China was a 'democracy' in the Western sense, probably no action would be taken at all with people selfishly voting for their immediate and perceived economic interests, and with the limited time available, China's emissions along with those of the West would greatly endanger the planet.

So Bomber, is should democracy really be put on a pedestal above all other concerns - even when it comes to the very survival perhaps of humanity itself?

 
At 13/9/10 10:33 am, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Very survival of humanity itself

FFS. All you 'the world is going to end' warmists need to get out more.

And China are building coal stations at a great rate. Often with less pollution (CO2 is not a pollutant) control than the West. Google pollution in China.

I will be interested in Bombers reply to your comment regarding democracy.

 
At 13/9/10 1:56 pm, Anonymous fatty said...

"If China was a 'democracy' in the Western sense, probably no action would be taken at all with people selfishly voting for their immediate and perceived economic interests, and with the limited time available, China's emissions along with those of the West would greatly endanger the planet."

I don't think no action would be taken....if they were a 'democracy', they would probably make better choices than us, because they are a collectivist society, compared to the west who are individualist. Democracy vs whatever would not influence environmental ignorance that much. (Though you are probably right, respect for others will be challenged by growing materialistic desires).

Individualism, capitalism, and consumerism are more influential. I don't think these 3 factors have to exist within a democracy.....but they usually do.

From what I've experienced, Chinese are far more educated about how their actions affect others than us, environmentalism is rooted within their culture (eg, medicine, food production), we've proven over the past 150 years we destroy to control our environment. China now seems to be following our lead.

Anon;

"And China are building coal stations at a great rate. Often with less pollution (CO2 is not a pollutant) control than the West. Google pollution in China"

Whats your point?....we out pollute the Chinese, cheers for the google heads up....sent me to a NY Times article....thats 2 mins of my life I'm never getting back.

"FFS. All you 'the world is going to end' warmists need to get out more."

Maybe you're right....maybe we spend too much time reading and analyzing information.
....I should just ask Google why we are better than the Chinese, then crack open a beer and talk about boobs.

 

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