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Friday, June 25, 2010

Why the new law being rammed through under urgency will lead to a Police State

Here is the reason why the new law being rammed through under urgency right now by National will lead to allowing the Police to create their own insidious local city political party.

The Officers running in local body elections will all talk to each other won't they? Let's say the Police stand someone in every position they can, all those elected Police Officers will get together, won't they? Will there be a rule none of them can discuss strategy? Of course not, will they be able to wear their uniforms while campaigning? Off course they will find a way, they will show in their billboards in some way that they are affiliated to the Police, that's their main sales point right? They will ensure they can in some way use it to let the old and frightened know they are a cop and the old and frightened will vote for them in vast numbers.

So the Police will enforce and write the bylaws, these elected Police Officers will meet eachother regularly to 'chat' about policy and bylaws and see if there is some resource they could all share to speed progress along, here are some of the 'policies' we will see getting promoted form our Police Officer local body politicians...

More surveillance cameras
More draconian bylaws against tagging
More draconian bylaws against boy racers
Police should be armed
More tasers
Anti-social abatement orders

...in fact they could just cut and paste that straight onto their billboards couldn't they?

I've read this weak defense by Andrew Geddis over at Pundit and am less convinced it is a justifiable position. Let's look at his argument...

First of all, is it really a problem to have a police officer sitting on a council at one time, then going out on the streets to arrest people for breaching the council's bylaws? Even if this is a technical breach of the separation of powers doctrine, what is the worst that could possibly happen? Do we think a police officer will only enforce those bylaws he or she supported at council, whilst ignoring any he or she opposed? I mean - we say the "separation of powers" matters as a general principle, but why does it matter in this specific instance?

Yes Geddis, yes it is a major issue you clown, look at his reasoning here and see how stupid it is. Geddis claims that there is no issue with the Police writing the law and then enforcing it, it is such a simplistic position I wonder how Geddis managed to get into the Legislation Advisory Committee in the first place. What Geddis seems to be unable to understand is not that it is an issue of a Police Officer choosing to enforce a bylaw they helped write, it is that the Police will swamp Councils with all the extra bylaws they want, like...

More surveillance cameras
More draconian bylaws against tagging
More draconian bylaws against boy racers
Police should be armed
More tasers
Anti-social abatement orders

...Geddis can't see that, Geddis just thinks it's an issue of a cop enforcing a bylaw they voted for. Sweet Jesus man, that is not the issue at all, it is that the Police Force will use these new Political Police to push their agenda of more Police Powers through the local councils.

That Geddis is unable to even sense that suggests he and his fellow bureaucrats are part of the problem.

Second, is not there some value to having the local police involved in all aspects of a community's activities - including its governance? If the aim really is "Safer Communities Together", then should we not treat constables and their supervisors as being a full part of that community, rather than as a potential threat to how it is run?

I'm gobsmacked at how naive this argument is (isn't it terrifying when you get a look into the star chamber to see how the wise and mighty make decisions and see it is as petty as this argument is?) If you want bloody 'safer communities' Geddis, then invite the community cop to come along and be part of discussions that are relevant to safer communities, DON'T GIVE THE POLICE THE ABILITY TO FORM THEIR OWN POLITICAL PARTY AND GIVE THEM FUCKING VOTING RIGHTS!!!

Third, is there not some mid-way solution to the potential problem of a police officer making bylaws which he or she then will enforce? After all, members of local authorities face all sorts of potential conflicts in their work which must be managed - from deliberating on matters that they have a personal financial interest in, to expressing a predetermined position before receiving all the evidence, to knowing the individuals who may be affected by a particular decision. Would not an internal rule that says "a member of the local authority who is a serving police officer may not debate nor vote on any bylaw" largely remove any constitutional concerns?

No Geddis, it wouldn't at all. The Police are supposed to be apolitical idiot, they aren't just another fucking public servant - THEY ARE THE ENFORCERS OF THE LAW! Allowing them ANYWHERE near the creation of the law as well as the enforcement of the law is a sacrosanct division needed.

What Geddis has defended is the Police creating their own insidious political party, here are the bitter fruits of this legislation..

Candidates will all use the same campaign material
Candidates will meet regularly to discuss blanket bylaw powers and have the laws written ready to be cut and pasted straight into the law books
Candidates will either follow the line they are told to tow by Police hierarchy or find themselves dumped from gaining 'support'.

It is utterly unacceptable that this major change is being rammed through under urgency, and it will create a defacto Police Party hidden under the veil of boredom local body politics descends to making the situation even more insidious.


At 25/6/10 2:15 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If life is the best experience you can have before studying as a Mature Student why won't you support Open Entry at Uni?

At 25/6/10 3:37 pm, Blogger Rangi said...

Whose bright idea was it to give the cops MORE power? There is a reason they are called law enforcement, what a stupid fucking idea.

At 25/6/10 3:41 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

under the search and surveillance act
the police will soon have the power to detain you, plant audio and video equipment in your house or work with out you knowing, and without a search warrant, yes people warrantless searches, if you work with somebody they suspect of doing something, it could be somebody in your class at uni, it could be somebody you have the occasional drink with, just you have associating with them makes you a target, and by the way you will your right to silence if questioned by the police,even if you have done nothing wrong, just your associating will them, and if you refuse to talk you can go to jail for a year!!!!yes thats correct a year!!!!

At 25/6/10 3:45 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Three weeks ago, the Search and Surveillance bill was pulled out of Select
Committee for re-drafting. We have scored a great, if temporary, victory
against the passage of this draconian law. The public protest and written
submissions to the Select Committee put the politicians on notice that we
were not prepared to sit by and allow longstanding freedoms and guaranteed
rights to be destroyed.

We need to continue the fight against the Search and Surveillance Bill.
The Select Committee has said that a revised bill may be introduced in
July with a view towards passage by October. This time we want to stop it

The Campaign to Stop the Search and Surveillance Bill formed in February
this year and has been working in Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch and
New Plymouth. We have raised awareness and educated people through public
meetings, stalls, printed material, an on-line blog and facebook group. We
have organised public protests against the bill with hundreds attending
across the country and good media coverage. We have been tremendously

We need your help to keep that campaign going. In particular, we need
funds to produce printed materials (leaflets and posters). Make a donation
to the Campaign to keep the fight going:

Account number: Kiwibank 38 9007 0239672 01
Account name: October 15th Solidarity

Please mark all donations with a reference to the Search and Surveillance

We will be encouraging people to make submissions on the bill when it is
re-introduced into Parliament. We hope that you will take the opportunity
to reiterate your views to the Select Committee.

Thanks again for your support.

Yours sincerely,

The Campaign to Stop the Search and Surveillance Bill

At 25/6/10 4:22 pm, Anonymous Molly said...

The fucked up thing is even in the 'terrorist' scare tactic country of America, they cant even pass a bill as sick as this! Now that's something to think about. We don't want to be mini America (GAG)!!

At 25/6/10 6:58 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dont give them the power? were powerless here! what the fuck are we gonna do if they do it and show up on one news wearing gestapo uniforms. nothing. maybe write to the editor of the hearld, thats about it. there aint fuck all we can do about it.

At 25/6/10 7:30 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...


I can ask everyone who reads this to email the link below,to friends and family and ask them to do the same,




At 25/6/10 9:22 pm, Anonymous Sal said...

How about stop spamming your stupid crap?

At 26/6/10 11:21 am, Anonymous Anonymous said...

hey sally whats stupid it

At 27/6/10 2:06 pm, Blogger Aoze said...

To anonymous @ 25/6/10 6:58 PM:
"...there aint fuck all we can do about it."
Don't fuckin' say "we"! If you want to cravenly submit to our overlords in NACT Inc, out of; admittedly justiable, dread of their ever increasing powers and general apathy; then that is your affair. However, do not presume to speak for me on this.

To Sal:
It'd be spam if it were posted in a blog regarding heroic soccer draws. This is a information regarding, and a link to, a site directly pertinant to the thread topic.

To Anonymous @ 25/6/10 3:45 PM:
But saying that; asking for donations & giving an acnt # while posting as "anonymous"? The link does seem to back you up, though I can't see the donation acnt # there. I won't be putting any money until I do!

To Molly:
You say "We don't want to be mini America (GAG)!!". Yet in doing so, use the americanism "GAG"; neatly demonstrating that we have in many ways already become a miniAmerica.


As for myself I agree that there is no point in stoping, or more likely; mitigating the worst of the S&S bill in parliament, if the police just fill in the blanks at a local council level.

At 27/6/10 9:12 pm, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Does this bill pass the Moonen test: All new laws must be compliant with the NZ Bill of Rights?

I have my doubts ergo it is illegal.

Kiwi M

At 1/7/10 3:11 am, Anonymous Anonymous said...

For those wondering what our new police overlords will bring us in the way of political integrity, now they can become councillors or mayors:

"They reveal that Labor powerbrokers Stephen Conroy and Robert Ray supported a push for Mr Ashby to become a federal MP at the same time as the OPI was investigating Mr Ashby."

Neil Ashby was then an Assitant Police Commissioner in Victoria, under investigation by the Office of Police Integrity (OPI)!

So, if the OPI didn't get whiff of this dodgy cop, he could have been a Labour MP and crokked cop. And this is not Corruptistan, it's our Anglo neighbours Oz.

P.S. Isn't this law just retro-tidying of some cops already being elected to councils? eg Cr Alf Filipaina (Labour, Mangere) and Angela Cunningham-Marino (Manurewa Community Board) - both reported in Manukau Courier as serving police officers.


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