National denied Tuhoe justice because white North Shore focus groups told them to
The Nation actually did some investigative journalism today drilling into the outrageous decision by Key to destroy 18 months of negotiation because Key was spooked by North Shore focus groups that suggested white National Party voters are nervous about National giving Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaooooooooooreeeeeeeee too much.
Tamati Kruger from Tuhoe was pointing out that Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, Christopher Finlayson said one thing for 18 months while Key dropped in at the last moment after a news story by Gower on TV3 about the deal almost being signed only to shut it down. The deal was done, there were even 'Agreement in Principle' pens engraved, that was how far the 'done deal was done', but Key drops in at the very last moment, destroying all the work by Finlayson to deny justice to Tuhoe.
The big question is why and the answer was in the Nation's new segment 'The Scoop'. According to The Nation, focus groups National conducted on the North Shore suggested that white National voters are concerned that Key was giving Maori too much (this is a party that had Don Brash as its leader remember, for all their pretense at diversity, red necks still gleam white hot in the National Party)
Joyce says the Tuhoe deal must be abandoned based on the North Shore focus groups, and because Key's political management is medicated and floaty with a slight detachment from reality at best, the Tuhoe deal had been allowed to go ahead with zero oversight, prompting a last minute bad faith ripping off of Tuhoe AGAIN by denying them the deal they had negotiated in good faith over the last 18 months.
Then John Key makes a cannibalism joke about Tuhoe the next day. We now know who John Key pitches his jokes and policy towards, white North Shore Aucklanders.
Ugly, how very, very ugly.
posted by Bomber @ 11:13 am
16 comments
16 Comments:
So you want the government to stop mining because 'thats what the people want'
But want the government to continue to give to Maori even though thats what the people dont want
Double standards.
"because Key's political management is medicated and floaty with a slight detachment from reality at best"
You're contradicting yourself.
If the Tuhoe were denied justice because National's focus groups were 'displeased' with the decision then it implies that their u-turn IS tightly managed to maintain their support. It appears that National ARE conscious of reality which is why they dropped this deal. It's fair to say that National do run a tight ship given their poll number (which left wing blogs don't even comment on now) or the alternative to that is that Labour is so shit the voters don't want to have anything to do with them.
Negotiating in good faith is largely irrelvent to the outcome. To do so doesn't necessarily mean that you will get what you want automatically.
I'm struggling to see your reasoning here. Not your best work by far.
North Shore = McCully. It's the exact sort of thing that Muzza would do - the same sort of interference from him against Maori that saw him convince his colleagues to scuttle the Maori TV RWC deal. Murray: present.
Nice to see the spin lines from the National Party research department so quickly echoed here from our first two anonymous posters. Let's go through them.
So you want the government to stop mining because 'thats what the people want'
You obviously haven't been reading this blog I want mining stopped because National have lied about the valuation, lied about the size of land effected and they have implied wealth well beyond the 1% we get back. In 2006 National told the mining industry of their intentions but didn't tell the electorate in 2008, did National receive money from the Mining companies to push ahead with mining schedule 4 conservation land based on a pack of lies?
So anon, your first assertion is utterly false, so let's see where you try and take this false assertion?
But want the government to continue to give to Maori even though thats what the people dont want
Ohhhhh - that's where this anonymous poster is going, you are misrepresenting my reasons why I disagree with mining to try and compare the 50 000 protest turn out against mining to a focus group of bigoted white people from the North Shore to claim a double standard? Is that where this predicatble and ill thought out post is leading to folks?
Double standards.
Ta-da, anon draws long bows from strings that are not there. Thanks for playing anon.
Next
"because Key's political management is medicated and floaty with a slight detachment from reality at best"
You're contradicting yourself.
What an embarrassing misreading of my post you have made, I understand your desire to hide your identity. My point is that John Key's bullshit mismanagement is to blame here, he wasn't aware of what was happening and they freak out post the Gower news story.
Let's give our anonymous poster a couple of examples of John Key's inept political mismanagment shall we folks?
Let's see, Melissa Lee's By-election Anon? Genius in motion huh? Richard Worths sacking which seemed to suggest Key didn't really know what he was doing that morning? Decisive decision making Anon will scream. What about the Rugby World Cup joke Anon? Where half the fucking cabinet were involved and ended up trying to outbid each other with our taxpayer money - Anon calls that leadership. Shall I focus on the Middle East trip anon or have you had enough?
Ket didn't know what the bloodyt hell was going on with this treaty deal and just stepped in at the end based on the bigotry of a bunch of North Shore white folk and you want to hold this kneejerk mismanagement up as a success and that I am contradicting myself? You should write comedy for 7 Days, they need you.
(which left wing blogs don't even comment on now)
Why does this anonymous poster lie? I've pointed out MANY, MANY, MANY times that the Polls are bullshit - it's even been on the TV show I do, yet anon pretends I haven't attacked those mainstream polls for the brainfarts that they are. Why must anon lie?
Negotiating in good faith is largely irrelvent to the outcome. To do so doesn't necessarily mean that you will get what you want automatically.
Justify bigotry if you want to anon, but suggesting that negotiating in good faith means nothing is just an empty joke I think most readers will be able to see through.
I'm struggling to see your reasoning here. Not your best work by far.
Well we can agree that you certainly are struggling.
I think the spin lines form National need to be A LOT stronger than the bullshit ones you guys have spun here.
Do you think those white North Shore focus groups laughed at John's cannibalism joke anon?
funny how these north shore whiteys scream out for justice -unless its justice for the maaaries!
North Shore = McCully. It's the exact sort of thing that Muzza would do - the same sort of interference from him against Maori that saw him convince his colleagues to scuttle the Maori TV RWC deal. Murray: present.
Duncan said that 'senior ministers' heard about the deal near it's close, conducted research and Joyce was given the job of using the research to shut down the deal at the cabinet meeting. You just KNOW that Murray was one of the 'senior ministers'.
Good thing for the Nats is that there has been no political blowback. How many votes will the Nats get from Tuhoe - nada.
A winner for sure and judging by this post the only ones who care wouldn't vote for national anyhow.
Good thing for the Nats is that there has been no political blowback. How many votes will the Nats get from Tuhoe - nada.
A winner for sure and judging by this post the only ones who care wouldn't vote for national anyhow.
Yes and no. If the Maori Party look weak, they will lose their seats back to Labour, so alienating them to keep white North Shore voters happy isn't necessarily the strategic brilliance you suggest.
It could have been, but the handling of it has been insulting to Tuhoe (to just come in after 18 months and screw over Finlayson by over ruling him at the last minute is just jaw dropping for Tuhoe) and with Key's cannibal joke, it has much more fallout than you are suggesting.
This was a bloody mess, and it has Murray McCully's claw marks all over it.
Key doesn't give a shit if the MP looks weak. He doesn't need them since he has enough votes to pass bill with Act.
And since Tuhoe hate the Crown anyway is it much of a loss to National? No.
So what if there is fallout? I'd say there is positive fallout since Key has clearly drawn a line in the forest which will in fact garner more support from those who thought he was soft on the Maori issue and demonstrated to the MP that they can only ask for so much.
Win-win situation.
"However, the Weekend Herald understands several ministers have varying degrees of opposition to the settlement, including Foreign Minister Murray McCully, Education Minister Anne Tolley and Deputy Prime Minister Bill English."
Tuhoe deal stalls over Urewera park return
By Claire Trevett and Yvonne Tahana
4:00 AM Saturday May 8, 2010
Key doesn't give a shit if the MP looks weak. He doesn't need them since he has enough votes to pass bill with Act.
You have inadvertently bolstered my point. You are 1000% right anon, John Key doesn't give a shit if the Maori Party look weak, and that's the problem. If the Maori Party look like the piece of camouflage they always were to make National policy seem moderate and Labour lite then Maori voters will demand the Maori Party cut a different deal at 2011 election OR the Maori Party lose those seats to the Labour Party. Either way it is a VERY stupid move long term for National.
And since Tuhoe hate the Crown anyway is it much of a loss to National? No.
Again, I think it's your narrow perception at play here Anon and you seem to be missing the impact on the Maori vote and their king maker position because of the Maori seats.
So what if there is fallout? I'd say there is positive fallout since Key has clearly drawn a line in the forest which will in fact garner more support from those who thought he was soft on the Maori issue and demonstrated to the MP that they can only ask for so much.
After missing all the previous points I've pulled you up on,this is your conclusion? The only way you could be right with this Anon is if National win an outright majority post 2011, and that's never going to happen.
Win-win situation.
Please, please, please email this strategy to National and convince them that bigoted white North Shore residents should dictate policy and that this is a sure fire way to increase the 45% National had at 2008.
"Please, please, please email this strategy to National and convince them that bigoted white North Shore residents should dictate policy and that this is a sure fire way to increase the 45% National had at 2008."
Please go ahead and post the strategy where National wins by pandering to maori radicals and secessionists.
If you havn't noticed politics is about numbers and there are more 'bigoted north shore' voters than tuhoe who will vote for national. So then what would be the rational response of national strategists who want to win the next election.
The MP are not 'kingmakers' if you hadn't noticed, ACT are.
As for your assertion that Tuhoe votes are valuable to National because they may vote for the MP this claim doesn't stand scrutiny.
The Labour maori MP's are nothing but uncle toms anyway so maori have no choice really. Where are they going to go?
Please go ahead and post the strategy where National wins by pandering to maori radicals and secessionists.
In the last election National's Big Blue Tent strategy was to pitch them selves as moderate and broad as possible, hence the relationship with the Maori Party to foster that pretense, if National are seen as pandering to white North Shore bigots, they lose that moderate perception.
You also seem incapable of understanding that the Maori Party won't be able to gain support amongst Maoridom after John Key's last minute pandering to those white North Shore volk. Labour marginalized Maori the same way to their detriment. By writing genuine grievance off as 'radicals and secessionists' smacks of arrogance and sounds like Helen 'haters and wreckers'.
You also miss that if National rely on ACT then they become as right wing as ACT, the perception of moderate Labour lite which National sold at the last election will be a broken brand unable to reach 45%.
If you havn't noticed politics is about numbers and there are more 'bigoted north shore' voters than tuhoe who will vote for national.
If you haven't noticed the Maori Seats look like being here for a while and slapping Maori in the face makes it hard for that Mana enhancing relationship to stack up in voters eyes either forcing them to vote for Labour in those seats OR force the Maori Party to look at another coalition partner post 2011.
So then what would be the rational response of national strategists who want to win the next election.
And I would give you ideas for that why? You are arguing their case, not me.
The MP are not 'kingmakers' if you hadn't noticed, ACT are.
I love your short sighted vision here, keep saying it, make it the National Party mantra, please email them, tell them this over and over and over again. National and ACT, National and ACT, National and ACT. I want people to associate John Key and ACT hand in hand.
The Maori Party are the kingmakers of the future, currently they are being used to camouflage ACT and National so the the Government look moderate in order to hold that middle ground they have gained. It's crucial that NZers see through that camouflage and see exactly what you are pointing out, that the current Government is really ACT and National.
It's important that National continue to denigrate the Maori Party by robbing Tuhoe of justice (topped off with cannibal jokes) so that the 2011 election becomes a chance for Maori voters to send the Maori Party a new mandate or vote the seats back to Labour.
Please Anon, continue to tell people this is ACT and National and that the Maori Party are mere camouflage.
As for your assertion that Tuhoe votes are valuable to National because they may vote for the MP this claim doesn't stand scrutiny.
This is the weakest comment you have made. Tuhoe has 18 months of good faith negotiation flushed down the toilet for a land confiscation that should never have happened all because John Key gets spooked by bigoted North Shore focus groups who think Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaareee are getting too much. And you don't see that will have any impact on Maori voters in 2011 when deciding to give their vote to the Maori Party? Please tell National to follow your strategy to the end. Please.
The Labour maori MP's are nothing but uncle toms anyway so maori have no choice really. Where are they going to go?
1000% agree, Labour tried to manage red neck NZ by confiscating the foreshore and seabed legislation. In the wake of Maaaaaaaaaaaareeee get too much speech by Don and Gerry Brownlee's 'their stealing access to my beach' campaign, Labour were spooked and passed kneejerk legislation just like John Key has. Labour had to learn the hard way that you can't manage Red neck NZ, you have to challenge it, attack it and burn it to the ground. Their simpering attempt to make the NZ bigot feel at ease was deeply damaging to their core Auckland cosmopolitan vote and I think had a big part to do with their massive loss. The last election was one of the lowest turn outs ever, that was disgusted Labour Party voters in Auckland not bothering to vote.
Denying Tuhoe justice after 18 months of good faith negotiation to pacify their bigoted white North Shore focus groups is not the moment of political realistic genius you are trying to paint here Anon. It is disgusting, it is pathetic and it should be decried for the cheap politics that it is.
It was cheap and disgusting when Labour did it, and it's still cheap and disgusting now that National are doing it.
No more taxpayer's money should EVER be handed to any racially selected group or individual under the excuse of treaty settlements.
The Waitangi tribunal and every government employee associated with it should be immediately sacked and pointed in the direction of the dole queue.
Every instance of word "Maori" should be deleted from the entire NZ statute as soon as possible.
The racist Maori seats in parliament should be abolished forthwith.
The End.
Have a nice day.
Bill.
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