Invercargill the new home of human rights crusaders
'Oh my god, the Gaza Strip has come to Invercargill'
Two women were shocked after being kicked out of an Invercargill cafe yesterday because they come from Israel.
Sisters Natalie Bennie and Tamara Shefa were upset after being booted out of the Mevlana Cafe in Esk St by owner Mustafa Tekinkaya. They chose to eat at Mevlana Cafe because it had a play area for Mrs Bennie's two children, but they were told to leave before they had ordered any food, Mrs Bennie said. "He heard us speaking Hebrew and he asked us where we were from. I said Israel and he said `get out, I am not serving you'. It was shocking." Mr Tekinkaya, who is Muslim and from Turkey, said he was making his own protest against Israel because it was killing innocent babies and women in the Gaza Strip.
"I have decided as a protest not to serve Israelis until the war stops."
Mr Tekinkaya is a hero, Israeli’s seems to be under some type of illusion that the rest of the world support them in their massacre, and seeing as a lot of Israeli’s holiday in NZ, it’s a great way to reach out to our Israeli brothers and sisters by refusing service during this appalling invasion so that they understand we are disgusted.
UPDATE: Kiwiblagh have linked to this story in an attempt to smear me as some type of Anti-Semite, which is the usual MO of Israeli apologists. Let me be very clear, as I posted in this thread…I have no problems with boycotts against regimes that do unspeakable acts and I have no problems letting the citizens of that country feel that displeasure, did you see the story yesterday showing that Israeli news media only shows their suffering rather than the horror they are creating - they need to hear it when holidaying in NZ. My only issue was that the cafe owner didn't actually check whom they supported before asking them to leave, there are many Israeli's who are as opposed to what Israel is doing in Gaza … this smear coming from David at Kiwiblagh is a farce when you consider how much of an apologist he is, we counted up the number of times he has spun Israeli aggression….
So when we look at local pro-Israeli opinion on the Gaza situation it really is quite appalling the barbarism some of them are willing to countenance to support the objectives of the Jewish State.
So let's go through one such blog as an example, I'm sure you are all familiar with Little Britain:
Now are you sure you want to back the Israelis on this one, David?"Yeah" (29/12/2008)
Even if the civilian toll will be severe? It will probably be quite severe.
"Yeah, I know, I know." (30/12/2008)
And you would rather comment on straw-man anti-semitism controversies in the local press than the humanitarian disaster in Gaza? Because it's going to be a humanitarian disaster.
"Yeah, I know." (31/12/2008)
You would deny the Palestinian refugees a right of return?
"Yeah" (03/01/2009)
And you would refuse to condemn the Israelis if they escalated the conflict and launched a ground invasion?
"Yeah" (04/01/2009)
And killed 500 people and counting? You'd just go on about anti-semitism and quote the equivalent of the discredited Protocols of the Elders of Hamas?
"Yeah. Yeah, I know, I know." (06/01/2009)
And if the Israelis use phosphorus weapons in built up areas you would rather criticise individuals at the UN?
"Yeah" (06/01/2009)
Even if they blow up the Palestinian parliament building? Even if they shoot at UN workers and facilities? You would rather give a lecture on the Holocaust while defenceless Palestinian women and children are being slaughtered by the score?
"Israel - I like Israel" (09/01/2009)
Right.... But haven't you supported protests in the past against regimes that employ repression and in your own words:
"Yeah - I know, I know." (10/01/2009)
But you want to back Israel?
"Yeah" (10/01/2009)
So... you want to back the colonial Zionist entity in their terror campaign against the Palestinian Arabs and you want to excuse and down-play and attempt to defend, or indeed ignore, the daily evidence that the IDF's campaign in the Gaza refugee camps is nothing more than a sustained series of war crimes against an already shattered people - most of whom are the children of refugees that Israel will not let back preferring to keep them in this hell-hole...
[UPDATE: 1:00PM Sunday:
"Yeah" (11/01/2009)
posted by Bomber @ 6:28 am
47 comments
47 Comments:
You really think this is fine Bomber?
Do you really think he's a hero?
I hope these woman take him to the human rights commission and ream him a new arsehole.
Taking the same logic - anyone who refuses a Muslim service in their business because of the situation in the Sudan or because Hamas blindly fire 'the odd skyrocket' at woman and children in Israel must be a hero too.
I hope these woman take him to the human rights commission and ream him a new arsehole.
Absolutely - civil disobediance of the law carries with it a legal risk.
Taking the same logic - anyone who refuses a Muslim service in their business because of the situation in the Sudan
Only if the person was a muslim sudanese though
or because Hamas blindly fire 'the odd skyrocket' at woman and children in Israel must be a hero too.
Well is resistance to occupation a reason not to serve someone?
Boycotting Israel (its products and government) is one thing; but boycotting every Jewish Israeli is quite another. Telling them (tourists) you don't like the Israeli regime and explaining why may be enough without denying them service.
Messages should be sent to Israelis that what their government is doing is an abomination, but I have doubts that a policy of "Jews out!" is the way to achieve it - because that is how it will come across to them (and that is how it might operate in practice by anti-semites).
Boycotts are tricky - who to target, how, secondary boycotts etc.
Maybe give Palestinians a discount? If it's good enough for the international community to discount them for 60 years...
Maybe give Palestinians a discount? If it's good enough for the international community to discount them for 60 years...
Hmmm - I like the Palestinian discount idea
How about a terrorism surcharge?
Do you support terrorist groups who rocket innocent civilians?
Yes?
That will be 20% more thank you..
How about a terrorism surcharge?
Or better still, an occupation surcharge, where you charge 40% more?
Will they have to carry their passports around as proof to get their discount? Come on, this is fucking ridiculous.
And as for kicking Israelis out of your shops? That is fucking stupid too.
Putting aside the fact that the cafe owner is Turkish and on this very site Bomber has climbed into the Turks for their massacre of Armenians, which they still won't own up to....
Maybe I'll kick any Fijians out of my store because I don't like what Frank Bananarama is doing. Maybe I'll kick Americans out of my store because of the Iraq invasion. Then maybe I'll kick and Danish customers out because of their treatment of Greenland, then there's English and Aussies for there involvement in Iraq, Chinese for not freeing Tibet, Russians for the invasion of Georgia, Japanese for the whaling.....
Look lets just save ourselves some hassles and hand out a piece of paper to every foreigner who comes into our country saying: "Fuck off, we don't like your country for what they done, you aren't welcome here."
I mean it isn't as if NZ needs all the tourism $ it can get right now is it?
Martin Luther King is a hero, Charles Upham is a hero, Mustafa Tekinkaya is a cranky little despot who should pull his damn head in.
Or better still, an occupation surcharge, where you charge 40% more?
I guess the Israeli's will be in line behind the Americans, Australians, Canadians, New Zealanders...
...people in glass houses.
As for the story...that is funny....
Best one for ages...
I thought boycotts were meant to target commercial enterprises and/or cultural ambassadors that provide support to Israel's government and its activities.
If the aim is to let Israeli tourists know how much people here disagree with the Israeli assault on Gaza, maybe the best approach would be for cafes etc to put up a sign to that affect for customers to see?
I don't want any tourists leaving our fine country with a bad opinion of it and or our people.
You can't persecute individuals based on their morally bankrupt goverment!! Did your 'hero' actually stop to ask them their views first? Bet he didn't.
If the aim is to let Israeli tourists know how much people here disagree with the Israeli assault on Gaza, maybe the best approach would be for cafes etc to put up a sign to that affect for customers to see?
Yes a, "I don't agree with what Israel is doing by killing over 1000 Palestinians" sign.
Yes a, "I don't agree with what Israel is doing by killing over 1000 Palestinians" sign.
He would need a pretty big shop front to cover all the atrocities in the world, and the countries perpetuating them, unless of course he only cares about Israel.
Likewise he would soon be out of business if every customer has to come from a country that has not commited any offence against any country/peoples.
and bomber just reaches new levels of ignorance and misdirection in his attemps to try and deal with this issue.
Carol said...
I thought boycotts were meant to target commercial enterprises and/or cultural ambassadors that provide support to Israel's government and its activities.
Which is why many of us had an issue with you targetting the Israeli tennis player.
And please don't say she is a cultural ambassador, because we can extrapolate that to any citizen is an ambassador of their country when they are overseas.
I'm going to go smear red paint and dog faeces (in lieu of my own blood) across the cafe windows as a sign of protest against Hamas baby killers.
I'm going to go smear red paint and dog faeces (in lieu of my own blood) across the cafe windows as a sign of protest against Hamas baby killers.
You're going to go all the way to Invercargill, find some dog faeces (you wouldn't want to collect the dog faeces before you travelled there as it would be smelly and yucky) and smear it all over this cafe? Really? Could you take some photos and post them back here?
I'm going to splatter red paint all over the footpaths outside every Turkish eatery I find, its a protest against the Turkish genocide of Armenian's and mistreatment of kurdish people. Me must boycott the Turks!
{sarcasm off}
See how stupid it can quickly get?
This is a vexed question.
On the one hand, one does not know the stance of an Israeli until one engages with him/her.
There is a chance that the customer might be among the 25% who would consent to living in the same apartment building as a Palestinian.
On the other, it was the Jews who invented the collective guilt of the German people, i.e. the good German, the ones who ignored the camps and did not protest.
Personally, I just simply say, "you are welcome to stay and enjoy my services but please convey this message to your Government", followed by a calm and reasonable explanation of my position.
This is New Zealand, not anywhere else - the world is crying - and in this country there is one law for everyone - a civil society builds a just society.
What a shame that the grandchildren of the concentration camp survivors have become hideous murderers themselves.
Everyone suffers - we are all capable of cruelty - it could be anyone of us.
Racial tension doesn't go away just because of the human rights act.
This guy should have at least asked their stance on it before refusing them service. (not that it would be any different under the law anyway)
"I don't want any tourists leaving our fine country with a bad opinion of it and or our people.
You can't persecute individuals based on their morally bankrupt goverment!!"
And you can't judge a country based on one immigrant resident/citizen kicking you out of his store...
"You're going to go all the way to Invercargill, find some dog faeces (you wouldn't want to collect the dog faeces before you travelled there as it would be smelly and yucky) and smear it all over this cafe? Really? Could you take some photos and post them back here?"
LOL
"I'm going to splatter red paint all over the footpaths outside every Turkish eatery I find, its a protest against the Turkish genocide of Armenian's and mistreatment of kurdish people. Me must boycott the Turks!"
Don't get silly now, theres the difference between what has happened and what is happening.
Tim Shadbolt:
"Oh my god, the Gaza Strip has come to Invercargill. Hell's bells."
"Generally speaking I am against all wars and I suppose people have got a right to protest. I couldn't really deny that. It would have been upsetting for the women and I feel sympathy for them."
......
"Personally, I just simply say, "you are welcome to stay and enjoy my services but please convey this message to your Government", followed by a calm and reasonable explanation of my position."
Exactly Brewer. Well said and I think enough said on this subject.
This is a vexed question.
Brewer.
Do you apply this standard of morality to every citizen of the World, or just Israeli's?
On the other, it was the Jews who invented the collective guilt of the German people, i.e. the good German, the ones who ignored the camps and did not protest.
Would you like to expand on this comment?
And you can't judge a country based on one immigrant resident/citizen kicking you out of his store...
Well Paul, you can judge a country by what it does in regard to the actions of the shopkeeper.
If he is not charged under the Human Rights Act, then it sends a message to the world that NZ condones discrimination against Israeli's.
And we know how that will be spun.
Good on him! Its his business he can serve whom ever he wants....and I would have done the same!
I would serve and israel murderer anymore then i would serve an american murderer!!
VICTORY TO HAMAS!
Kerry said...
Good on him! Its his business he can serve whom ever he wants....and I would have done the same!
I would serve and israel murderer anymore then i would serve an american murderer!!
VICTORY TO HAMAS!
As you are not even allowed to work in the tuck-shop unsupervised kerry, I doubt you are in any position of banning Israeli's from anything.
But thanks for informing us of your bigotry.
I would serve and israel murderer anymore then i would serve an american murderer!!
VICTORY TO HAMAS!
Its a good thing that you are clearly to stupid to ever be put in charge of a shop then.
Don't get silly now, theres the difference between what has happened and what is happening.
Right, so in a week or two's time when the raid on Gaza is over you are going to forget this? Turky has never taken responsibility for the genocide of the Armenians, we should at least ask Mustafa what he thinks about before we start carrying his self righteous arse on our shoulders on a victory lap of Tay Street.
Im now going to boycott all kebabs, taxi driven by Arab's, not buy Hummus (Pun intended) etc etc. then i will be just as stupid as those two idiots down in invercargill. It's anti-semitism by any other name and has no place in this country. Are these shit-on-a-stick merchants full citizens yet? if not lets deport them to say we don't tolerate any kind of discrimination.
Oh dear.
It is not my job to do your research. A simple search or asking your grandfather would have saved you displaying an ignorance that is probably commensurate with your age.
If you read this article you will get the meaning of the term "good German".
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/14/opinion/14rich2.html
On the other question, it is probably a good exercise for you to search Raul Hilberg and Gerald Reitlinger who put the total deaths at 5.1m and 4.1m respectively (I think). As these are two of the most "respectable" Historians on the subject, this is sufficient to support my statement.
I have little interest in these matters.
Did the Jews suffer terribly during WWII? Yes they did.
Was it the worst example of such suffering in History? No it wasn't.
Does it excuse the descendants of Jews displacing and committing the same atrocities on the Palestinians? No it does not - they had nothing to do with it.
Is the holocaust waved around like some form of inoculation that absolves Zionists of their crimes? Yes it is - you seem to do a bit of it yourself.
Did Zionists collaborate with the Nazis? Yes they did, Yitzak Rabin among them.
Should people who have opinions on these matters be locked up for expressing them? No they should not.
Do I think you are a tendentious pain in the arse of quite low intellect, yes I do.
I hope that answers your question, and some others you hadn't thought up yet.
I will no longer respond to this kind of post. If you wish to dispute any of my assertions, find a rebuttal, post a link and I will debate.
I have a quesiton that is completely off topic, but hey now is a good a time as ever to ask (this conversation is getting stagnant anyway).
What do people think of evacuating the west bank of all IDF presence, and replacing it with some sort of international peacekeeping force that would remain there until there is stable palestianian leadership, and no threat of suicide attacks to israel? It would (ideally) take away israels unwanted role as being the oppressor, and lead the way to a palestinian state. What would probably happen is that this international coalition would become the new oppresors, meaning the palestinians have to put up with the same shit, but i think it is an idea that needs to be considered.
If it changes nothing, why consider it?
Awesome. If we had a PM with any backbone he would refuse all Israelis entry to the country!
Bomber, do you believe it is acceptable for a business owner in NZ to refuse service/entry to a prospective customer because they don't like what their Government is doing? If so, that is an absolutely appalling position to take for a left winger who believes in social justice and equality and I believe that you have lost huge moral ground here when you next make posts about bigotry. (And yes, I hate what the IDF is doing - but one assumes that Natalie and Tamara have no say in it).
I have no problems with boycotts against regimes that do unspeakable acts and I have no problems letting the citizens of that country feel that displeasure, did you see the story yestrerday showing that Israeli news media only shows their suffering rather than the horror they are creating - they need to hear it when holidaying in NZ. My only issue was that the Kebab owner didn't actually check whom they supported before asking them to leave, there are many Israeli's who are as oppossed to what Israel is doing in Gaza. Oh hey Mark, you forgot to add Anti-Semitic to your attack on me.
Mrs Bennie, a New Zealand citizen who has lived here for seven years, said she was shocked when she and her sister, visiting from Israel, were told to leave the cafe.
It wasn't an "attack" on you - if you feel it was then I can assure you I didn't mean it that way. It was merely a robust comment. I simply think this is a pretty nasty precedent and approval of it can come back to bite you - it seems to be a case of "acceptabel discrimination". Natalie and Tamara aren't the ones doing the bombing.
if it was an israeli refusing to serve an arab there would be hell to pay! double at least the amount of protesters! were are such a scared of the brown man nation
Guess I have to Boycott The Turkish Kebabs until Turkey apology for killing 1.5 Armenian Christians, 40,000 Greek Orthodox Christians, Assyrian Christians etc.. Or even Recgonize they commited Armenian Genocide.
Would the Turkish Pub kick out Israeli Arabs too?
It wasn't an "attack" on you - if you feel it was then I can assure you I didn't mean it that way. It was merely a robust comment. I simply think this is a pretty nasty precedent and approval of it can come back to bite you - it seems to be a case of "acceptabel discrimination". Natalie and Tamara aren't the ones doing the bombing
That's right, fuck the 1203 Palestinians killed (400+ of them children) - AN ISRAELI WOMAN CAN'T GET A CUP OF COFFEE IN INVERCARGILL. Silly me that's the real issue isn't it?
The challenge for New Zealanders is to ensure that the information being published in our daily newspapers is authentic for us to be able to “honestly express ourselves on matters of personal principle.”
David Cohen (NBR available on the web) has written some excellent articles on the situation. “It’s hard to see how any self-respecting media progressive could enthuse for Hamas. The group’s bloodcurdling covenant is not about achieving a democratic Palestinian state alongside Israel, but about pushing the Jews, homosexuals, feminists and others into the sea, and destroying any opportunity for developing a vibrant economy and better material life for their own citizens. That’s what its leaders say, and their actions have consistently borne this out.”
Whale Oil blogger has compiled a list of recent hoaxes put out by the international media since the start of Israel’s defensive military operation.
Karl du Fresne in his blog writes of the Journalistic Deceit from TVNZ - “Television news and current affairs has almost compromised itself to a standstill through gimmickry, artifice and prestidigitation of one form and another.”
Barack Obama had this to say when he visited Israel in July 2008. “If somebody was sending rockets into my house, where my two daughters sleep at night, I’m going to do everything in my power to stop that. And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing.”
Hamas blatantly depicts itself as a victim, but Hamas continues to portray itself as the heroic killer of Israelis.
I am a supporter of the US and Israel. I will never buy into your Palestinians=good, Israelis=bad nonsense.
However, I fundamentally believe three things are necessary for any cohesive society.
Freedom of expression
Freedom of exchange
Freedom of association
I support the right of any business owner to refuse to do business with person or group of people for any reason without having to answer to the potential customers or any third party including the government. I also support the right of any business to make public the criteria on which potential customers will be excluded.
Bill.
"
However, I fundamentally believe three things are necessary for any cohesive society.
Freedom of expression
Freedom of exchange
Freedom of association
I support the right of any business owner to refuse to do business with person or group of people for any reason without having to answer to the potential customers or any third party including the government. I also support the right of any business to make public the criteria on which potential customers will be excluded."
Well Said Bill....you get the principle and the real rights issue here...no one else seems to.
Massacre in Gaza. Check out the photo of the unborn child shot thru his pregnant mother's belly...
http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/01/06/gaza-horror-large-photo-gallery-of-gaza-massacre-by-israel/
"Don't get silly now, theres the difference between what has happened and what is happening."
That is so ignorant about what's happening in Turkey that it's not funny. Turkey is not better than Israel. If anything, it's worse.
Hello, sweetums!
I face a dilemma. I am tasked with interviewing engineers for a successful business employing many many Kiwi talents. Next week I am going to conduct an interview with a turkish immigrant who has extensive experience in our field of operation.
Until this moment I didn't really think of him any differently from any other candidate (if s/he is good he is a "hire" else s/he is "no hire").
But your blog has made me think, when I prepare technical questions for the interview, shall I take into account that my wife is of Armenian descent? Yes or no?
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