BREAKING NEWS
Another Prison Death
I’ve just received word that another Prisoner has died this morning in Auckland Remand – details are sketchy but it looks like it was a suicide caused by stand over tactics from a gang.
When will New Zealanders accept that Prison is not a hotel? I understand that the idea Prisoners get a cushy time inside infuriates many fair minded New Zealanders, but the truth is considerably different to the tune that Simon Powers sings for populist support. Prison is an ugly, brutal place, and the actual prison environment only exasperates the problem, if we refuse to see that all we create are more warped and damaged prisoners leaving jail to create more harm in society.
We need Prison reform and we need it now.
posted by Bomber @ 12:54 pm
24 comments
24 Comments:
Could not agree more, Bombs
But while they are in prison they cannot rape, rob or kill you.
And most people in prison deserve to suffer to make up for some of the suffering they have inflicted on their victims.
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Come on Deano, I know you are right wing, but dude you can't be happy with people committing suicide - only SOME of those inside rape, rob and kill. What about people busted for dumb shit like weed? The majority of people in Prison aren't there for serious convictions, you've got shitloads in there for drug possession - and I'm sorry but that isn't a good reason to die
I don't consider myself right wing, more a centrist, it's just that the positions you take on this site are usually so far to the left, I feel the need to oppose them.
You are right, no-one should be in jail for drug possession, or trumped-up sedition for that matter, but violent criminals should be kept well away from us.
People commit suicide outside of prison too- far too many in this country, but that's a whole other story.
Bomber, the majority of people in prison deserve to be in there, or perhaps you would like to take the likes of Sam Te Hei in as a flatmate.
Amazing selective morality you have.
Oh by the way Bomber certain drugs are still illegal in NZ....not happy, see your MP about changing the law.
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Am I missing something here? Folks, OF COURSE we don't want violent criminals wandering around hurting others - I'm not suggesting we open the gates and let everyone out - some of the people in there are very damaged BUT (and this has always been my point) the Prison experience MAKES THESE PEOPLE WORSE! What part of that arguement is so difficult for you all? What I can't stand about the right wing conservative voices in our country is that they want to cling to a system that doesn't work (weed laws are another good example). Of course we should keep violent offenders away from society, but the current prison system only warps people further - we need prison reform, we need to create safe enviornments within Prisons where people can be rehabilitated, I mean the majority of Criminals can't read or write - how the fuck are they supposed to be reformed from their time in a brutal prison system - come on guys, the current system DOESN'T WORK - surely we can all agree on that?
Bomber, the problem is you are not being logical.
You say prïson makes these people worse - who exactly are you referring to, Tim Selwyn, all the minor druggies unfairly in there, Tim Shadbolt, Tama Iti, Ahmed Zhuoi, Dr Minnitt, Lesley Martin, all the white collar fraudies who go on to run businesses???.
Following your argument Selwyn will be worse when he gets out of prison.
Do you know every person that has been in prison? How do you know what happened after they got out.
How do you know its prison that made them "worse" and not other factors.
Worse than what exactly Bomber.
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GROAN - Come on Anon - are you even trying anymore? Have you heard of something called the 're-offence rate' - what do you think that is? Isn't it currently running at 7 out of 10 re-offend, usually committing worse crimes? What I'm saying is that the Prison environment dehumanizes prisoners and we all stand around tsk tsking when those prisoners come out and commit worse crimes.
(big sigh) please answer the questions Bomber.
Be specific not general. What exactly is a worse crime than say, child murder that those released committed, pray tell me please.
Cmon give me some facts, after all Ive given you some names.
p.s. shouldnt it be the re offending rate?
The reoffence rate is a good argument for never letting some of those people out.
Also, it is a good indicator of the character of some of those in our prisons- violent, lazy and greedy. Oh, stupid as well.
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I disagree that the parents are not to blame - they state he has A.D.D. in an article a couple of months ago in the North Shore Times - how does a child with A.D.D. get better in Prison? Putting a 17 year old in prison is up there with getting the Kahui family to babysit your twins - the mistake these Parents made was thinking the Prison system was safe - I spoke with inmates on Saturday inside Prison, and it was all they were talking about, one asked me "Do they really think it's safe in here" - sadly I told him that NZers still think it's a hotel inside prison - they were astounded
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Oops - sorry Anon - HERE is the info on reoffence rates off the Department of Corrections website - it's just under 7 out of 10 prisoners who re-offend - the Department itself makes the point that "Changing their behaviour will bring about the greatest reduction in reoffending." - is this specific enough for you?
New Zealand figures are fairly consistent with the above. Community Corrections has a reconviction rate of about 64 percent, and Public Prisons about 67 percent (Mulligan 1991, Forsythe & Love 1983, Oxley 1979, Asher 1985, Rush & Love 1982, Killalea & Piesse 1967, Bakker & Riley 1994, Lovell & Norris 1990, Bakker et al 1995 a,b).
Psychological treatment resources clearly cannot cope with 60 to 70 percent of the total corrections population. But reconviction alone is a crude measure and should be qualified by frequency and seriousness of reconviction. Unfortunately most reconviction rate studies lack this information. A conservative conclusion can be drawn from those that do provide it: about 40 percent of those reconvicted are reconvicted once only and often for a minor offence (Rush & Love 1982, Forsythe & Love 1981, Broadhurst & Maller 1990, 92, Burgoyne 1979, Oldfield 1997). Taken overall, this information suggests about a quarter to a third of the corrections population at any time comprises offenders who repeatedly reoffend, often seriously. There is some evidence these offenders commit most crime. Changing their behaviour will bring about the greatest reduction in reoffending.
Much better. However hardly relevent to your earlier posts of prison making people worse. All it tells me is people in jail have been there before - hello, their criminals.
Interesting line - reconviction alone is a crude measure
Are you also aware that murderers (life sentences) generally have a low rate of re offending?
Make one think doesnt it.
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That's a bullshit reply Anon -you weren't even aware of those rates when we started this debate - the current system only makes things worse, the figures show that we have a reoffence rate of just under 7 out opf 10 - IF (and the fucking report says this) we spent time on those who reoffend we could make real inroads into stopping crime - and of course lifers have a lower re-offence rate - many murders are a spur of the moment thing that people regret.
It makes me think with people like you out there that we will never have progressive ideas to really try and change these issues, and the same bullshit conservative ideas will continue to dominate.
There are plenty of people with ADD who don't go and commit crime after crime like Liam did, putting his parents at their wits' end.
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Crime after Crime? Deano I had a look at his charges and they seemed to be set all around a couple of days, and please explain how someone with ADD gets 'better' in prison - hey I know, let's ask Liam how safe prison is?
Bomber - since when do we expect the prison system to cure ADD
Knowing a few prison officers, they work their guts out trying to help people inside, but you know about horses and water.
Also try not to swear, it shows a limited vocabulary, not least bad manners.
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Um - Anon, 2 things -
1: Bomber - since when do we expect the prison system to cure ADD - that was my point
and 2: Also try not to swear, it shows a limited vocabulary, not least bad manners - my ficking site, my fucking rules
anon 30/8/06 6:55 PM , lol DOH!!
Ahh Boomer its Tims site isn't it?
AB
This site is much better with bomber anyway, and strictly speaking, bomber is administrating is in tim's absence, so for all intents and purposes, it's his.
You can't honestly think that prison is working. If you've seen The Shawshank Redemption you'll know the line that goes along the lines of "the ironic thing is, i had to go to jail to become a criminal". Yes, the majority (i would hope) of people in the prison system deserve to be there, but they and we as society in general, deserve a system that works to stop re-offending the best it can to actually serve the purpose of having law and order.
Right Sam - The shawshank redemption.
Ok
/steps back slowly towards the door/
and Sam if you ever came here before boomer got his sickeningly lefty mits on Tims baby you would know what most of us know -
WE WANT TIM BACK SOON - BOOMER SUCKS
AB
but AB - this site has been busier with more people talking on it than I've ever seen, and I've visted this site for nearly 6 months - it's a lot more vibrant now and in the media- aren't you just talking our your arse?
Good link here shows how much of a handful Liam Ashley was and how his parents tried everything they could:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10399353
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