Baghdad: Situation Normal
100 Iraqis are being killed EVERY DAY in Baghdad, which is exactly what is supposed to be happening. The insidious reality of American policy in Iraq is a direct throw back to counter insurgency techniques used countless times before by the United States and Israeli governments. What do you do when you are an occupational army that is outnumbered by the people you are oppressing? Simple, you divide and you then conquer. During the Irish ‘troubles’, British security officers would pretend to be Catholics who went out and shot Protestants, they would then pretend to be Protestants and shoot Catholics. This divides the community and inflames hatred, anger and fighting between groups rather than have that anger and fury directed at the occupier.
America has taken billions out of their ‘reconstruction’ budgets and spent it on Counter-insurgency programs. CIA trained paramilitary death squads attached to different ethnic factions within the Iraqi internal ministry are blamed for the majority of mass ethnic based killings which are terrifying the civilian population and directing anger and fighting towards each other, rather than at American troops. Last year a torture chamber was discovered in an Iraqi internal ministry building by regular American forces, much to the embarrassment of the Iraqi and US high command as the torture chamber had been set up with their full approval. To my knowledge, no one was ever charged.
This type of despicable behavior is not new, we have seen it in South America, and in particular, Vietnam in a program called the Phoenix Program. Phoenix was the code name for a counter-insurgency program that the U.S. adopted during the Vietnam War, in which Special Forces teams were sent out to capture or assassinate Vietnamese believed to be working with or sympathetic to the Vietcong. In choosing targets, the Americans relied on information supplied by South Vietnamese Army officers and village chiefs. The operation got out of control. According to official South Vietnamese statistics, Phoenix claimed nearly forty-one thousand victims between 1968 and 1972; the U.S. counted more than twenty thousand in the same time span. Some of those assassinated had nothing to do with the war against America but were targeted because of private grievances. William E. Colby, the C.I.A. officer who took charge of the Phoenix Program in 1968 (he eventually became C.I.A. director), later acknowledged to Congress that “a lot of things were done that should not have been done.”
God bless America?
posted by Bomber @ 9:44 am
12 comments
12 Comments:
……………………………..Sigh, Deano I really wish I could live in your rainbow world where the powerful and elite who own all the media, and most of the resources and all the power act with benevolence upon us lucky mortals, oh how care free and wondrous your fairy tale land must be. Sadly I can’t share your starry eyed denial as corporate media outlets (some owned directly by the arms companies making profits from the war they are selling, GE owning NBC for example) pawn us a war without any real questions or justifications. These people who strap bombs to themselves do so because they see the injustice all around them, they are acting like any of us would if we were that desperate. I’m not justifying acts of violence, but like that nice chap Nelson Mandela once said, “The occupier states the nature of the struggle”. Remove the reasons these people feel justifiably angry at the West, and see if these extremists retain popular support.
There is a common thread to your posts Deano, blind denial to even attempt to understand why the people on the other side act the way they act. It’s almost as if you don’t care ‘why’ they do it – if you can’t understand the ‘why’, you can’t hope to find a solution. The only solution you keep coming up with is from laser guided phosphorous bunker busting missiles dropped on fleeing refugees and ambulances. Call me old fashioned Deano, but I don’t think that’s much of a solution.
I understand why the people on the other side act as they do Marty.
It's called Islam.
History has reached a crossroad of sorts. Yes the West has been responsible for many evils, but in general we believe in freedom with our values of democracy, freedom of religion, rule of law, freedom of speech, the legacy of Greece and Rome.
Islamism, on the other hand, believes that only their way is right. Girls who associate with boys are put to death in Iran. The Taliban disallow women the right to any education and ban all music. To renouce Islam in most countries is considered apostasy and punishable by death. Even in progressive Arab countries like Dubai being gay is illegal. This religion is rooted in the Middle Ages and it is a threat to our planet. People riot, kill and burn over cartoons. Many innocents have been killed in suicide bombings from Iraq to Israel, from NY to Bali to London. I personally was in Kuta 3 weeks before Jemaah Islamiyah struck. I lived in London opposite Aldgate East subway station for a period right up to the attack last year. This is a clash of civilisations bud, so where do you stand? At the moment we hold the upper hand in terms of economic and military power. That is the only thing at the moment keeping your throat from being slit by an Indonesian's sword. They would commit genocide on us in an instant if they had the power, and weren't caught in their own Sunni-Shiite schism. We have to be vigilant, defend ourselves on a global scale, and not make excuses for barbarism, like claiming suicide bombings in Baghdad by muslims are actually our fault. There is a lot of narcisistic self-loathing in the West. America is far from perfect but who would you have running the world? Iran? Syria? China or North Korea? I'm rambling a bit, had a few beers watching the rugby, but it ills me to see your bias. Sunni kills Shiite- let's blame the West?
……………………………..You know that scene in 12 angry men where the guy who has been most strident against the person charged gets goaded into his incredibly racist rant where he justifies his bigotry and violent reaction to blacks as ‘reasonable’, all the while the other Jury members slowly and silently get up and turn their back on him in shame?
I think we just had one of those moments.
Deano, with all due respect bro – I think you need to re-examine some of the things you’ve said here for your own sense of intellectual self respect. I have read what you have had to say on a variety of posts, and your arguments have not been persuasive at all, in fact they seem to be a cocktail of Talkback radio misperceptions, anger and ignorance. I could not understand why on each issue you would take a binding black-and-white-moral-absolute–might-is-right position, why it is that you are so hard on everything without an inch of compassion for your fellow man?
Seeing your last post makes me understand it a little. Bro, that diatribe you just launched sounded like the sort of rhetoric you would hear from German Brownshirts, in early the 1930s, you caricature an entire religion as ‘Evil’ – you added everything except the racial facial characteristics of the bloodthirsty Muslim. I was waiting for an Ali Barber and the forty thieves reference.
1:
I post a blog regarding the CIA funding death squads in Iraq along sectarian lines so that they can start a divide and conquer campaign, just as they have done and has been done by all major powers once they become absolutist tyrannies justifying their actions. Your response? I’m a conspiracy theorist – what the fuck? So the counter insurgency tactics didn’t happen in South America? All those killed by Paramilitaries funded by the CIA didn’t happen? Just like its not happening in Iraq? Just like it didn’t happen in Vietnam – Deano where did I get the word Phoenix Program from? I mean did I just make that up? Type the word Phoenix Program into google Deano and see what comes up – I just made all that up did I? Deano you are wrong, these things happened, and if you are not educated about those programs and the wide spread misery the US inflicted – DO SOME READING – if you’re going to comment on things, know your shit.
2:
Your whole rant about Islam. God there are so many places to start here. Maybe a series of questions might help.
Deano please answer the following
a) Could you explain why America lavishly supports Saudi Arabia who are the most hard-line old school, chop your hand off for stealing, Muslims around if we are fighting them?
b) Could you just walk me through your brilliantly insightful theory, ‘The Deano Code: Bloke-down-pub-told-me-all-about-them-Muslims’ history of the Islamic religion? How can Muslims be judged for the extreme reactions of some and the whole religion gets blamed, but we didn’t do that with the Protestants and Catholics fighting in Ireland and write all of Christianity off?
c) On the subject of Islam, did you know Islam was more technologically and scientifically advanced than Christianity? That 800 years of anti-Muslim propaganda has attempted to steal most of those advancements and claim them as Christian? Did you know Islam had a working theory on gravity 500 YEARS BEFORE NEWTON, indeed Newton took many of his thinking from Muslim Scholars! Brilliant thinkers like Al-Kindi, Al-Farabi and Lbn Sina mean nothing to us in the West, but each were equal to any of the West’s great minds. What about Ibn Sina, Al-Razi and Ibn Khaldoon who were at the forefront of astronomy, medicine, philosophy and mathematics? In fact, it is thanks to the rediscovery, translation and reintroduction of classical texts by Islamic scholars, that the European Renaissance was able to take place. What about Ibn Rushd, known in Europe by the name ‘Averroes’, who translated Aristotle and in medieval Europe was regarded as ‘The Commentator’ on Aristotle. He was held in such high regard that Raphael even included him in his painting ‘The School of Athens’, which depicted all the great ‘Western’ thinkers. Unfortunately the West seems to have forgotten or conveniently overlooks the role that Islamic thinkers have played in history. Although the hundreds of words of Arabic origin in English such as, chemistry, zenith, zero, alkali reflect this influence.
What about Ibn Battuta who rivals Marco Polo as one of the world’s greatest travellers. In the 14th century he travelled all over the Muslim world at the time, which stretched from West Africa to Indonesia and it is instructive to compare his report on black Africans he met in Mali to later Europeans. He sees them as having admirable qualities and being just and pious, whereas Europeans found only savages ready to conquer. This also underlines the racial equality found in Islam and how the community of Muslims, the Umma, are supposed to treat each other equally.
The decline from reasoned struggle ‘ijtihad’ to blind reasoning, ‘taqlid’ occurs in the 14th century. Since then Islamic societies have developed in many different ways and many modern fundamentalists, who claim to be acting in Islam’s name, have little to do with the true message of Islam. However, it seems unlikely that progress will be made unless Muslims become aware of and take pride in their own heritage and revive the dynamic, forward-looking aspects of Islam which served them well in the past. And this can not be done when America props up dictatorships in the Middle East which use and abuse Islam to hold the populations ignorant and obedient.
BUT OF COURSE – none of that is true right Deano? I mean they are all just violent blood thirsty dirty Muslims and it’s our God given right to destroy them eh Deano? I mean there is no redeeming factors within Islam at all eh mate, all these names I’ve rattled off – none of that matters right, they are less than human aren’t they mate – you got a final solution here at all Deano, or are you feeling a little embarrassed by your limited viewpoint?
Bomber,
I am not a racist or a bigot. I am a realist. Yes many muslims are peaceful and good people, but the religion itself is a cancer, and it's values belong to another time, and some of the cultural values epoused by it are evil. Our culture has done some evil things, eg. slavery, but thank goodness we have evolved in most areas. Islam has not, it is still rooted in the Middle Ages. I read on Tim Blair's blog yesterday about how a girl in Iran was executed for crimes against chastity (going to a party at a boy's house). WTF? What about the murder of Theo Van Gogh? And the terrorist incidents I described? The list of atrocities commited not just by muslim extremists but by muslim governments is unbelievable. A few isolated incidents is not representative of a population, but hundreds of terrorist attacks around the world per year, and backward repressive cultural mores
are.
1. No doubt the Americans have meddled in other countries' business before. However the scenario you posit is hard to swallow. I will look it up though. However that such actions taken place in different parts of the world in different times is not definitive proof that it is happening in Iraq now. To all appearances the US wants stability there. Why would they incite more violence? You say to divide and conquer. Conquer what? Iraq is costing the US billions and they want to bring their troops home ASAP to save money and lives but won't until more stability is achieved.
2. a)I'm no fan of the Saudis, and no doubt the relationship is based on economics and also had a strategic element, in that the US could have bases in the region. And sometimes being allies with a nation with questionable human righs record enables you to exert some pressure on that nation to reform.
b)Religion is shite. Christianity has been responsible for the Inquistion, witch-burnings, the Northern Ireland conflict you mention, and denying condoms to Africans who could use them to stop getting AIDs. However, who is strapping bombs to themselves and blowing up innocent people right now Bomber? Is it Hindus? Buddhists? Catholics? Mormons in Salt Lake City? No, the only religion which seems to condone this sort of nastiness is Islam. Only Islam also tries, in this day and age, to assert itself over other religions and deny them a chance to exist. Ambon. Southern Thailand. Many provinces in Indonesia. Sudan. Somalia. Afghanistan. Aceh. I read about Islamic terrorists in southern Thailand slitting the throats of random schoolgirls, just because they go to a Catholic school. Only Islam is, today, this barbaric. Mohammed himself was a thief and killer, did you know that?
c) The key world in your first sentence is 'was'. Most cultures have achieved great things at some stage in their past, but what about the here and now? What do you think about the rules of sharia? Opression of women? Islamic rules on apostasy? Putting girls to death for associating with boys? Don't tell me you are a cultural relativist. Especially the values you espouse Bomber, are precisely the kinds of things outlawed in an Islamic nation- freedom of religion, freedom to be gay, freedom of speech, and in some Middle Eastern nations the right to have a say in the political process.
Final solution? You exaggerate the things I said in my previous post. I am not calling for genocide, despite the fact that a jihad is basically being waged against us. I am just saying we should be prepared to defend ourself, and to not stand for any barbarism, or make excuses for it, like blaming it on us.
Oh look on the TV, the UN building in Beirut has just been stormed. Now it's not just 'Death to Israel, death to the US', but also 'Death to the UN'.
.................................Deano, we are so close to you back-peddling here I feel like we are about to make a huge breakthrough in your dislike of others through this intensive public counseling session we have embarked on – I think most people who have read these postings will have made the clear decision who they think is right – but the point I want to make is on your final note here,
Oh look on the TV, the UN building in Beirut has just been stormed. Now it's not just 'Death to Israel, death to the US', but also 'Death to the UN'.
NOW – W-H-Y did the Lebanese do that Deano – why did they attack the UN building? Because my main beef with you is that you jump to conclusions without thinking much about the wider issues – The Lebanese attacked the UN base RIGHT AFTER the Israelis launched an air strike on the village of Qana which KILLED 60 LEBANESE in one hit, many of whom were children! The Lebanese attacked the UN building in protest and fury that their citizens are being murdered while the world looks on and does nothing.
It’s like being at a bar, and two people start a fight. And the guy called Israel has punched the other guy to the ground and is still kicking him while he’s on the ground, viscously stomping on his face, and his huge mate America is looking on to make sure no one stops Israel, while the rest of us stand around nervously looking at one another, knowing that what is being done is wrong, but too frightened of America to do anything.
But you Deano say that the storming of the UN building is a message that the Lebanese want to attack us? Is your bias that huge that you can’t really see what is going on? They stormed the UN building in a rage because 60 of their citizens were blown up in one hit, many of them children – you said you weren’t a bigot, but only bigots are this blind.
Some would say that it is time for the illegal occupational forces in IRAQ to leave.....but that would be the worse thing that could happen. The US now must stay and rebuild. But I have fears that they will not, Iran & North Korea will be the next occupied nations. Whilst I do not say that would be a bad thing, The USA must finish what it starts if it is going to ignore the UN ( as toothless as they are!) and invade countries for what it deems to be valid reasons. This of-ourse will not happen. The US will leave and IRAQ will be the loser.
I think Deano must had a very difficult childhood to be so keen to support such ruthless killing of women n children by israel.
Does anyone know of any good head doctors i could recommend?
Deano said: "I personally was in Kuta 3 weeks before Jemaah Islamiyah struck."
so what? I lived in London when the IRA were bombing Harrods, and my flatmate who worked there came home covered in blood. Do I hate all Catholics. I hope I'm not that blinkered, or at least not as blinkered and hate filled as you.
I live in Indonesia, the biggest Muslim country in the world, full of good, decent, caring people, 85% of whom espouse a faith which you seem to feel makes them a lessor person that you or your ilk. The one thing all these people, who want to live their peaceful lives, feel, is a massive sense of being under attack by the west, by, in particular, the United States. During the time the US Navy was helping with Aceh reconstruction, the F/A-18s from the carrier were, without permission, doing training bombing runs over the country.
These people don't want to be you, they don't think you have the right to tell them how to live their lives, they hhave no desire to know about the racist arrogance which makes you think you know better.
Yes, some provinces in Indonesia practice Sharia law, but they have no desire to destroy me, I am welcomed to these places. They just want to live thgeir lives and practice their religion. This is no better illustrated than by the Christian Church and the Mosque which sit next door to each other down the road from me. The children of each have a joint youth group. My god (whichever one you wish to believe in), the hate that shows, eh Deano?
Your posts show more bigotry and hate than I've encountered in years of travelling in the Muslim world and I suspect says more about you than them..if you want to see the true face of the hatred you go on about, I'd advise you to buy a mirror.
Simon,
The true face of hatred is me? O-okay, 'my posts show more bigotry and hate than'- the Bali bombings? Tell that to the families of the dead Australians. 'There isn't any problem with Islamic extremism in Indonesia, and I should know, because I live there. Bali (x2)? Didn't happen. Attacks on Western hotels, embassies and businesses in Jakarta? Didn't happen'. Not to mention that fundamentalist rebels are waging an escalating campaign of jihad attempting to fracture Indonesia into a number of autonomous provinces.
I'm glad where you live that there are moderate muslims and you live in peace and harmony. Great. But to say there is no hate and bigotry in Indonesia... well, you are talking out of your ass.
....................................Sigh - and here was me just trying to point out things people might not know about how America has a hand in a lot of the dirty wars we have, and how they have a role in the sectarian killings in Iraq - of course the mainstream media won't point this out to you, so its up to places like this to do it. You expect reistance to those ideas, when you really challenge a persons world view, it threatens them and they get angry, then we get the name calling - and then finally 30 years from now when someone in the mainstream finally gets brave enough to point out what we all knew to be true at the time, you get acceptance without a backward glance. Such is history.
Dear oh dear, Deano, angry man in armchair who knows all. "Not to mention that fundamentalist rebels are waging an escalating campaign of jihad attempting to fracture Indonesia into a number of autonomous provinces."...when you spout your small minded shit at least know what in gods name you are on about rather than making yourself look so silly. There are a variety of, mostly fizzled rebellions in Indonesia, tagged by some of the western press, although not the more reliable sorts, as jihad. I assume you have read, investigated and understand what is actually happening in these places, but I guess not, as illustarted by your rather cartoonish reponse. Aceh was one, there is another in the former Spice Islands and a third in West Papaua. All are economically based and have little to do with religion beyond an easy tag. The Ambon and Poso issues are both tied to corporate strugggles..but, hey, you knew that..you were just pretending to be ignorant, right?
No-one is excusing the bombings in Jakarta and Bali but, once again, ther are other factors at play here as well, none of which make that right. But to slam a nation and a religion, the vast and overwheming bulk of whom are as digusted with this as any Australian is, or any American was with Oklahoma City. There is hate and bigotry all over the world, including Indonesia with its 220 million people, but sadly, as your posts indicate, you are far more guilty of such than 99% of them.
................................Anon is right Anon (I get so confused when its anon.com) - dude what is happening there directly effects us, and if we were under attack, wouldn't you want someone somewhere standing up for your rights?
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